Prabhu Chawla speaks to Niira Radia (please crosscheck)

  • IMP-Prabhu Chawla Gas judgement discussion-20090620-143207 

Needs a volunteer to crosscheck.

The transcription of the above tape of Prabhu Chawla has been done by Prabhu Chawla himself. I’m sure it must be an accurate translation, but just to be sure we must double-check all transcriptions. So please cross-check it and if there are any inaccuracies, point them out in the comments.

Prabhu Chawla sent this transcription to Outlook as part of his clarification.

*

NR: Hi Prabhu

PC: Yaa tell me now

NR: Nahii nothing, I was just wanting to understand things from you. You always have a very good perspective.

PC: On What?

NR: On everything bhai, he he he he. Generally you have a good perspective of everything. I just wanted to know what is yr view on this great historic judgment.

PC: Which one, the Bombay one?

NR: The Bombay one which takes the family pecked above the national interest.

PC: You see when the brothers are involved, the nation also gets involved naa?

NR: Yaa, probably not a good thing naa. Not good for the nation.

PC: Not good for the nation, but the brothers don’t talk to each other. There is nobody who can force them to talk also

NR: Who tho ho gayi na Prabhu tum bhi janthe ho

PC: Maine koshiosh kiyi thi., Nahi hua. Maine kaha ho jayega.

NR: Nahi. I was speaking to him recently, in fact this morning

PC: (interrupts) is he back from wherever he had gone, Mukesh?

NR: . He is very much here, he has been here the whole week.

PC: He was abroad last week I think.

NR: No no no.

PC: Anyway, somebody told me that he is abroad.

NR: NONONO. He has been here the whole week. He is not due to travel till next week.

PC: because sometimes he responds. Abhi I have stopped calling him Because usko maine 15-20 din pehle message bheja tha. Then he never responds. Uske baad maine message nahi bheja. Before the judgement was coming I wanted to probe on him.

NR: Kya judgement uske khilaf aa rahaa hai?

PC: Haan, lekin itnaa arrogant hai na. uske saath kya kare? Uske arrogance, dono bhaiyyon ka samajh bhi nahi aatii mero ko

NR: Prabhu tell me one thing. Judgement is fixed, right?

PC: Dekho in this country, dono side ko fix karne kii capacity hain. Chhotta bhai mobile jyada hai. Paise kam kharch kartaa hai, kanjoos hai sabse jyada. But he is more mobile than the elder brother. Elder brother doesn’t want to go beyond what Dhiruibhai left behind with him. Men or people, whatever. You are getting what I am telling? He is totally depending on the people that Dhirubhai created. They were relevant at that point of time. Now they are not relevant. Anilbhai has developed new sources, new contacts , new way of thinking. Mukesh,Apnii wife ki … thodaa jyaadaa dictate karti hai. Anil ki wife nahi karti hai. The way things are moving, Mukesh poor fellow is not able to get the right feedback because of insulation from various other sources. Now I know what he is doing on the Supreme Court front. Various things. Which is not the way to go about it. What he doing it is known to the rest of the world. This is not good. If he has to….because everything is fixed these days. Ab Supreme Courtme reverse ho gaya, then he is finished for ever, yaa? If he doesn’t get a favourable response from Supreme Court, then he is finished, naa?

NR: But Prabhu ek baat bataon?

PC: Ha?

NR: Abhi tak Supreme Court ka, between you and me, kuchh finalise huaa nahin?

PC: Finalise kaa matlab kya hai? Bhai Murli Deora bhi jayega court mein. Prime Minister is also putting pressure on Murli Deoa to settle it. Because ultimately it is national loss naa, as you put it. Itna mehanga ho rahaab 2-3 mahine mein 90 dollars ho jayegaa, if you are not able to take out gas from your own sources, then there is a problem, naa Country should not suffer because of these two brothers.

NR: That’s right. Which what Mukesh has told his brother very clearly. What is the issue? Anil …usne apne gas ke liye kabhin manaa nahin kiyaUsne kaha tera 28 mm sidhi ban tha hai.Agar NTPC baraa nahin leta tho thera who bhi ban tha hai. Yeh 2.34 who government ki pricehai, mein us mein decide nahin karta huun as an operator. Uska point limited woh hai. Aapne MoU dekha? I don’t know whether you have seen it, but I will show it to you. Un mein aisa kich likha nahin hain.

PC: . MoU mein mein pataha nahin, maine dekha nahin, so I cant say, frankly speaking , and MoU mein, agar court ne order kiya, kuchh basis pe kiya hoga naa. Pata hua naa

NR. Nahin. Court kaa order mein, 328 pages mein I can give you any , I can tell you, wo pen drive use kiya hoghi na, wo jo telecom ka TD se judgement hua na, dual technology ka Vahanvati ne jo karvaya, Raja ne Dr Sarma ko TRAI chairman banaaya. I am guaranteeing same pen drive use kiyi hogi.

PC: hahaha (laughs)

NR: Mein tumko dono judgement (Mumbai) aamne saamne dikhaoongaa, tun dono padlo.

PC: Goolam Vahanvati is an old friend of mine. When I was editor of Indian Express, he was our counsel. Mera bahut acha dost hai. Pehla Nusli wadia ke saath tha. He was a goods friend of Nusli, I think even now he is with Nusli. But he is very close to Anil Ambani. Everybody knows about it. Appointment…..Anil Ambani, Nusli Wadia and our power minister, kya naam hai, Shinde, they all went for him. Bhardwaj never liked him. Bhardwaj would have made him the attorney general. Ab ban gaya wo. See these brothers have to come to the conclusion themselves first. Kyonki agreement to hoga court mein ja karke Supreme Court ne order dono ko ikkate dediya to. That is one way of looking at it. Because basically this judgement will decide the future of both of them na? More of Mukeah than of Anil. Anil ko kyaa? Power planthi shuru nahin kiya, kya karna gas se?

NR: Judgement 17 saal se likha nahin to gas tho dena chahiya kal seUsko bolo chal tu le.Kya keraga uske saath? Kuch nahin karega.

PC: Aur le nahin sakta. Theek hai, bolo uttalo gas.

NR: . Aur paise do uske liye.

PC: Haan paise do, bech nahin saktaa kisi aur ko. Judgement… you cant sell it to anybody else na?

NR: Correct

PC: Theek hai, then let Mukesh sell it wherever he wants to sell it. Ab Mukesh ka objective kya hai, I don’t know. You are not clear because …unka yahan Anand Jain to baahar ho gaya naa? He is out, naa?

NR: Nahi nahin, he is very much there. Again ye Anil ki baat hai. Mein usko itni baar khud dekh chukkii

PC: I don’t know, because people on both sides are haraamis, advisors.

NR: Nahin, ek baat bataauun tum ko. Anand Jain is very much there. Manoj Modi is very much there. Mukesh is very much there.

PC: Manoj Modi is little more professional

NR: He is very professional

PC: Anand Jain thoda politics karta hain

NR: But is matter mein Manoj Modi jyada hoga na?

PC: Jo bhi hain, but now Supreme Court mein aana hi hai case. Aur  A nil Ambani ne caveat file kardii.

NR: Wo tho karega na

PC: But since you…you should should convey to Mukesh that the way he is going about the supreme Court is not the right way.

NR: Matlab, you mean he is going to the SC, you are saying he shouldn’t go to the SC?

PC: The way he going to thje SC, I wont tell you more than that. The people he is using are not the kind of people who can be trusted for keeping it to themselves. Bol dete hain, abLondon mein baithke kuchh bhi boloAchchaa nahiin lagtaa naa, it gets back. London is not so far, it just a phone call away. Political system….People may be projecting he is close to Sonia, he is close to Rahul. Mukesh has got access, but he cant influence anybody. Collective jyadaa ho gaya naa. Kamalnath can decide one thing but he can be overruled by Pranab Mukherjee. So ye saara loose ends ko tighten karna hain na?

NR: Prabhu, mere ko tumhara London ka point catch nahiin kiyaa

PC: Matlab, he is trying to understand how to go into the Supreme Court.

NR: I don’t think so Prabhu, tumko yeh kisne bataya?

PC: . Chhodo na

NR: Nahiin seriously, mein tumse kyon chupaoongii?

PC: He has to go to appeal in Supreme Court or not finally?

NR: He will have to appeal in the Supreme Court, the question doesn’t arise

PC: If he is appealing to SC, he must be trying…the right people. Harish Salve will appear for him. Because he is an outstanding advocate. But he must be thinking if there any way, like, Anil must be using various ways, he must also be thinking if he can use various ways or not. Brothers apne apne tareeka dono lagayanega naa?

NR: Anil apna lagaa hogaaapne logo ke through, DMK ke through , apne Chief Justice ke saath.

PC: No, Chief Justice Kerala ka hain. Par Mukesh bhii to kar rahaa hogaa naa? Mukeh jis tariike se approach kar rahaa hai is not the right way, that’s what I am saying.

NR: I understood what you are saying.

PC: Now yo u understand naa?

NR: Main baat karoongi thodi der mein, I will tell him to speak to you.

PC: I sent him messages, 10 bar messages bhejaa, he doesn’t reply. I don’t want to come into….because my son is a retainer for Anil. I don’t want to discuss with him at all. Lekin sun to letaa hoon naa, idhar udhar political logon se. But he not appearing for him. My son is not involved in this case at all.

NR: Your son, naa?

PC: Haan, he is not involved at all

NR: Why?

PC: He doesn’t trust my son also, in this case. (laughs)  Anil doesn’t trust my son (in this case).

NR: Your son is with whom?

PC: He is a retainer for Anil. He is running his own independent company. He is not with Ryan [?] any more. He is running his own solicitor firm. He was retained by various people. Anil’s mobile is one company which retains him. But in this case he is not involved. But idhar udhar se pick up tho karte hain na cheezen sab.

NR: Right right

PC: my information is through the legal sources. Once you tell him that Prabhu was saying something about you talking to people in London, he will understand.

NR: Chalo I will tell him

PC: Chhota Bhai bada haraami hain.

NR: Harami tho hain lekin har waqt harami panna last nahin karta na?

PC: Question is, when you are working in a system which is not clean, bhai tumhare ko nuksaan tho ho gaya na? Tho recovery karte raho apne aap. It is better to do it in a manner so that you are not the loser. Main kal jaa rahaa huuN Bombay. Ek baar usne kahaa thaa dinnerpe aana ghar pe. He called, me. I was the only senior editor there. After that I tried to meet him but nahin mil paayaa. I went a couple of times to Bombay recently but he was not there. I have been trying to reach him par uske baad baat hii nahii huii.

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4 Responses to “Prabhu Chawla speaks to Niira Radia (please crosscheck)”


  1. 1 Kamayani November 27, 2010 at 5:39 am

    think even now he is with Nusli. MISSING…He is with sharad pawar also s..But he is very close to Anil Ambani…..

  2. 2 PC November 27, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    NR: Hi Prabhu

    PC: Yaa tell me now

    NR: Nahii nothing, I was just wanting to understand things from you. You always have a very good perspective.

    PC: On What?

    NR: On everything bhai, he he he he. Generally you have a good perspective of everything. Trying to understand what is your view on this great historic judgment above the national interest.

    PC: You see when the brothers are involved, the nation also gets involved naa?

    NR: Yaa, but probably not a good thing naa. Not good for the nation.

    PC: Not good for the nation, but the brothers don’t talk to each other. There is nobody who can force them to talk also naa.

    NR: Who tho ho gayi na Prabhu tum bhi janthe ho

    PC: Maine koshiosh kiyi thi., Nahi hua. Maine kaha ho jayega.

    NR: Nahi. Abhi nahi. I was speaking to him even recently, I spoke to him this morning, the question of ..

    PC: (interrupts) is he back from wherever he had gone, Mukesh?

    NR: . He is very much here, he has been here the whole week.

    PC: He was abroad last week I think.

    NR: No no no.

    PC: Anyway, somebody told me that he is abroad.

    NR: NONONO. He has been here the whole week. He is not due to travel till next week.

    PC: because maine to. sometimes he responds. Abhi I have stopped talking to him, calling him

    NR: No. He’s been here the whole week. I just spoke to him this morning also. He is very much here. He is not supposed to go anywhere till next week.

    PC: Nahi. Maine to usko.. somebody… I didn’t… Usko maine 15-20 din pehle message bheja tha. The he responded. Then I asked again. Then he never responded. Maine usko message nahi bheja phir. Because the whole judgement was coming, I wanted to forewarn you.

    NR: Kya judgement uske khilaf aa rahaa hai?

    PC: Haan, Arrogant hai na. uske saath kya kare? Uske arrogance, dono bhaiyyon ka samajh bhi nahi aatii mero ko

    NR: Prabhu tell me one thing. Judgement is fixed, right?

    PC: Dekho in this country, dono side mein fix karne kii capacity hain. Par bada bhai hain naa.. Chhotta bhai mobile jyada hai. Paise kam kharch kartaa hai, kanjoos hai sabse jyada. But he is more mobile than the elder brother. Elder brother doesn’t want to go beyond what Dhiruibhai left behind with him. Men or people, whatever. I think… You are getting what I am telling?

    NR: I understand.

    PC: He is totally depending on the people who Dhirubhai created. They were relevant at that point of time. Now they are not relevant. Anilbhai has done… has developed new sources, new contacts , new way of thinking. That can be possiblity ki Mukesh ko apna… Ek uski wife bhi thodaa dictate jyaadaa karti hai. Anil ki wife nahi karti hai. The way things are moving, Mukesh poor fellow is not able to get the right feedback because of insulation from various other sources. And I know what he is doing on the Supreme Court front. Various things. Which is not the way to go about.

    NR: Hmm.

    PC: What he doing it is known to the rest of the world. Which is not good. Usko thoda… If he has to…. because everything is fixed now these days.

    NR: Ab Supreme Court mein reverse ho gaya, then he is finished for ever, yaar! If he doesn’t get a favourable response from Supreme Court, then he is finished, naa?

    NR: But Prabhu ek baat bataon?

    PC: Ha?

    NR: Abhi tak Supreme Court ka, between you and me, kuchh finalise huaa nahin?

    PC: Finalise kaa matlab kya hai? Bhai Murli Deora bhi jayega court mein. Prime Minister is also putting pressure on Murli Deoa to settle it. Because ultimately it is national loss naa, as you put it. Itna mehanga ho raha hain fuel, ab 90 dollars ho jayegaa 2-3 mahine mein, if you are not able to take out gas from your own sources, then there is a problem, naa. Country should not bloody suffer because of these two brothers.

    NR: That’s right. Which what Mukesh has told Anil very clearly. What is the issue? Anil… Usne (Mukesh) kabhi apne gas ke liye manaa toh kiya nahin. Usne kaha, theek hain, tera 28 mmscmd bantaa hain. Agar NTPC 12 nahin leta toh tera woh bhi ban tha hai. Theek hain. Lekin 2.34 ki price hain, woh government ki domain hain, mein us mein decide nahin karta as I am an operator. Uska point limited woh hai. I don’t know, aapne MoU dekha hain? I don’t know whether you have seen it, but I will show it to you. MoU mein aisa kuch likha nahin hain.

    PC: Nahi. MoU mein pata nahin, maine dekha nahin isiliye I cant say, frankly speaking , and MoU mein, agar court ne order kiya, toh kisi basis pe kiya hoga naa. Padha hoga court ne.

    NR. Nahin. Uska court kaa order mein, 328 pages mein I can give you anything, I can tell you, woh pen drive use kee hoghi na, Prabhu, woh jo telecom ka TDSAT ka judgement hua na, dual technology ka Vahanvati ne jo karvaya hain, Dr Sarma.. Baad mein Raja ne phir Dr Sarma ko TRAI chairman banaa diya. Woh, [abrut change] … guaranteed ki same pen drive use kee hogi.

    PC: hahaha (laughs)

    NR: Mein tumko dono judgement aamne saamne dikhaoongi, tum dono padlo. Usme jo… Dono wordings mein…

    PC: Ghulam Vahanvati is an old friend of mine. When I was editor of Indian Express, he was our counsel. Mera bahut acha dost hai purana. Nusli wadia ke saath tha pehle. Nusli wadia plotting [abrupt cut] We were goods friends of Nusli. Even now a good friend. [inaudible] Sharad Pawar also. But he is very close to Anil Ambani. Everybody knows about it. Appointment..Anil Ambani, Nusli Wadia and our power minister, kya naam hai, Shinde, they all went for him na for the apointment of [inaudible]. Bhardwaj never liked him. Bhardwaj would not have made him the attorney general agar Bharadwaja law minister hota. Ab ban gaya wo. The question is these brothers have to come to the conclusion themselves first. Kyonki agreement to hoga court mein ja karke Supreme Court ne order dono ko acceptable de diya, that is one way of looking at it. Kyonki abhi to you are basically the whole judgement will decide the future of both of them na? More of Mukesh than of Anil. Ki Anil ka to saala power plant hi shuru nahin hua, usko gas kya karni hain saale ko?

    NR: Judgement mein usne 17 saal to likha nahin hain. Mujhe lagta hain kal se gas de deni chahiye usko. Usko bolo chal tu le. Kya karega uske saath? Kuch nahi kar sakta.

    PC: Aur le nahin sakta. Theek hai, bolo utha lo gas ja kar ke.

    NR: Aur paise do uske liye.

    PC: Haan paise do, bech nahin saktaa kisi aur ko. Judgement you cant sell it to anybody else na?

    NR: Correct, correct.

    PC: Theek hai, bhai. That, that… let Mukesh sell it wherever he wants to sell it. That should be the… Ab Mukesh ka objective kya hai, I don’t know. You are not clear. Because unka yahan jo Anand Jain to baahar ho gaya mere khayal se. He is out, naa?

    NR: Nahi nahin, he is very much there. Again ye Anil ki phili hui baatein hai. Yeh galat baat hain. Mein usko itni baar khud dekh chukkii hoon.

    PC: I don’t know, because people on both sides are haraamis, advisors.

    NR: Nahin, ek baat, sach baat, bataa duun tum ko. Anand Jain is very much there. Manoj Modi is very much there. Mukesh is very much there.

    PC: Manoj Modi is little more professional

    NR: He is very professional

    PC: Manoj Modi very much professional. Anand Jain thoda politics karta hain ki uska apna dhanda bhi hain. He has more influence on…

    NR: But iss matter mein Manoj Modi jyada hoga na najadik?

    PC: Haan, Manoj Modi jo bhi hain, but now Supreme Court mein aana hi hai case. Anil Ambani ne caveat file kardii. Kal parson kee.

    NR: Woh toh karega na. He has to safeguard his interests.

    PC: But since you have access to Mukesh, you should should convey to Mukesh that the way he is going about the supreme Court is not… I won’t give you anything more than that. It is not the right way.

    NR: Nahin, “not the right way” matlab, he is going to Supreme Court, he shouldn’t go to suprement court?

    PC: No, no, no. The way he going to the Supreme Court. I wont tell you more than that. The people he is using, they are not the people who can be trusted for keeping it to themselves.

    NR: Hmm..

    PC: Bol dete hain, ab London mein baithke kuchh bhi bolte hain. Achchaa nahiin lagtaa naa, it gets back. London is like… London is not London. It is a phone call away.

    NR: Hmmm..

    PC: Usko thoda… He must be… Political system hain Delhi mein. Change ho gaya. Mukesh. Mukesh ne bhi.. People may be projecting whatever he is close to Sonia, he is close to Rahul, he is close to this. But may be Mukesh got access, but he can’t influence anything. Collective jyadaa ho gaya naa. Kamalnath can decide one thing but he can be overruled by Pranab Mukherjee. So ye saare loose ends ko tighten karna hain na?

    NR: Maine tumhara London ka point catch nahiin kiyaa

    PC: Matlab, he is trying to understand how to go into the Supreme Court.

    NR: I don’t think so Prabhu, tumko yeh kisne bataya?

    PC: Chhodo na ab.

    NR: Nahiin seriously, mein tumse kyon chupaoo baat? Sach-mooch. I mean. Come on.

    PC: He has to go to appeal in Supreme Court or not finally?

    NR: Agreed. He is appealing to Supreme Court. He will have to appeal in the Supreme Court, the question doesn’t arise.

    PC: If he is appealing to Supreme Court, he must be trying to find out the right people. Harish Salve toh uska advocate hain hee. He will appear for him. Because he is an outstanding advocate. But he must be thinking if there any way of, like, Anil can use various ways, he can also use various ways or not. And you know what. Brothers are not… Clean to dono mein se… apne apne tareeka dono lagayanega naa?

    NR: Haan. Anil Ambani apna lagaa hogaa, apne logo ke through, DMK ke through , apne Chief Justice ke paas yeh sab.

    PC: No, Chief Justice Kerala ka hain.

    NR: Haan. Kerla ka.

    PC: He is not… Yeh bhi lage honge na kisi ke through? Mukesh bhii to kar rahaa hogaa naa? Phir? Wohi keh raha hoon. Mukeh jis tariike se approach kar rahaa hai, if that’s what I heard, is not the right way to go.

    NR: Theek hain. I understood what you are saying.

    PC: Now you understand naa?

    NR: I will… Main baat karoongi thodi der mein, I will tell him to speak to you.

    PC: Yeah, Because, I sent him messages, 10 bar messages bhejaa, he doesn’t reply. I don’t want to come into. Because my family is a retainer for Anil. I don’t want to discuss with him at all. Lekin sun to letaa hoon naa kai baar, idhar udhar political logon se. But he not appearing for him. My son is not involved in this case at all.

    NR: Your son, naa?

    PC: Haan, he is not involved at all

    NR: Why?

    PC: He doesn’t trust my son also, in this case. (laughs) Anil doesn’t trust my son (in this case).

    NR: Your son is with whom now?

    PC: He is a retained by Anil naa. He is independent. He is running his own independent company. He is not with Ryan [?] any more. He is running his own solicitor firm. He was retained by various people. Anil’s mobile is one company which retains him. But in this case he is not involved. But idhar udhar se pick up tho karte hain na cheezen sab.

    NR: Right right

    PC: my information is through the legal sources. Once you tell him that Prabhu was saying something about you talking to people in London, he will understand.

    NR: Chalo I will tell him

    PC: Chhota Bhai bada haraami hain.

    NR: Harami tho hain lekin har waqt harami panna last nahin karta na, Prabhu you also know.

    PC: Question is, abhi, when you are working in a system which is not clean, you have to be… bhai tumhare ko nuksaan toh ho gaya na? Udhar recovery karte raho apne aap. It is better to do it in a manner so that you are not the loser.

    NR: Theek hain.

    PC: Main kal jaa rahaa huuN Bombay. Ek baar usne kahaa thaa dinner pe aana ghar pe. That is about… He called me one day. You remember [inaudible] mein gaya tha uske liye. I was the only senior editor there. After that I tried to meet him but nahin mil paayaa. I went a couple of times to Bombay recently but he was not there. I have been trying to reach him par uske baad baat hii nahii huii.

    [abrupt end]

  3. 3 Ishani roy December 1, 2010 at 4:34 am

    Hi I have cross checked this.. its fine…

  4. 4 Meenal December 11, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    The “Ryan” mentioned in the Prabhu Chawla tape is Ryan Karanjiawala. Famous solicitor.


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